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How do you know?

Posted on Sep 18th, 2008 by michaelsits : in spite of myself michaelsits
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Before I came to Korea, some of my friends were intent on me “finding a good one to take home with me”.  As offensive as this is to me and the women of Korea as a whole, it doesn’t mean since I have been here I have not reflected on the beauty, kindness, simplicity and grounded nature of many of the women I have encountered during my short time of more than two months.  In fact, the comments made before I hopped on the Airbus to spend nearly eight thousand miles in the air may be the thing that has kept me from exploring some options.  Well, that is not exactly true.

Here in central Asia, men and women do not wear wedding rings.  They do not actually display anything that would alert a would be pursuant that the individual they are about to initiate courting rituals with is already married.  Based on the fact that most adult Koreans do not just flirt with strangers who think they are attractive, there really is not a simple way to explore potential options.

I have reflected on what it would be like to be in your late twenties and single, which is the not the norm, and try to figure out whom you can and cannot pursue honorably.  Unlike the west, married women do not get their kicks out of flirting while married to prove to themselves they are still attractive.  Married women here are rarely focused on their ability to look “hot”.  So, how do you know?

Again, this is not like the States where asking someone out casually is common or even acceptable.  When men and women reach the neighborhood of thirty, the family places pressure on them to find a mate, even more so for women than men, which of course is not surprising.  When dating someone who has reached that age range, the expectation is that you are dating for potential marriage partners.  This increases the pressure for all involved, male and female. 

I am older and there are really not any women at or near my age that are not married, so the whole ring thing is not a big deal for me since they would all have rings if that were a social norm.  But this does not mean those in the thirties I do not look at as we peruse through the cabbage or mandarin oranges in the local market together.  I look at their shopping carriage and see items that indicate family: baby products, cleaning supplies, junk food and quantities too large for an individual.  In Korea, there are not women who are single with children, it just doesn’t happen. I do not know how prevalent abortion is here. There is a large Catholic influence and generally people hold more traditional values than many western cultures do.  I make the leap that they are not available without giving it another thought.  Besides, I do not know how or what are the courting practices here except that often families still arrange marriages.  Oh yeah, and I do not speak HanGul yet.

Leaving all the personal details aside, how would one know anyway? 
How would you know?
Access_public Access: Public 14 Comments Print views (186)  
Nicole : wakingdreamer
11 minutes later
Nicole said

how would you know…

puzzling, Michael. How do you feel about all of this?

michaelsits : in spite of myself
25 minutes later
michaelsits said

Humm. i thought that may not have been clear although my intention in writing the piece.
On a personal level, disappointed knowing i do not have a means to begin dating a woman i may become attracted to.  with that said, that might be a good thing for the moment. 
On a social level, i think it is great for women in a way and for men in a different way.
women first since that is where my mind will always gravitate.  I think it is great for a woman to not be judged or branded according to her ring, its status and what being married places on her.  In cultures where rings or other jelwery or symbols of marriage clearly mark women as one or the other.  Example being Miss  and Mrs.  Of course, not having that ring in a culture where being married is so heavily expected, those who are trying to meet someone may pay some consequences.
For men, i think it is less significant except for men that cheat on their wives.  Of course, the men that are trying to find a wife are working against the lack of symbols ability to let them know who is on the market and who is not.  In a culture where men do all the initiating, the lack of rings or other physical symbol adds some complications and obstacles.  It would not surprise me if natives are able to tell by some other non-assigned, subtler cues that let them know who is not married and who is.  me being a foreigner would not be able to discern these forms of symbolism yet, or at all.what do you think nicole?peace,michael

Nicole : wakingdreamer
about 3 hours later
Nicole said

you're probably right, those subtler cues could take a number of forms.

there are ways it does seem like a good thing for you personally. less pressure while you get accultured, learn the language, and live out what you are there for, in all that entails.

given time you could figure out how one does go about the dance, there.

what you say about no one being single with children intrigues me. no divorce? widows tend to remarry? no unwed mothers? such a different society in so many ways!

michaelsits : in spite of myself
about 3 hours later
michaelsits said

no divorce, there are few widows since people don't die young here.  I guess there are widows but not in there middle aged years, just older.  No unwed mothers that i have heard about.  Again, remember i am still new here, so i don't know all the dirty secrets if you will.
A different society, like taking the world pre- “the world is about me and what i want and i need” and adding technology and fashion and you are here.  They have not taken on western values, just american pop culture for young folks.   I n many ways, they find all the divorce, sex, drugs,crime, self-centeredness, status, etc of the western world an embarrassment to us as a species.  It is less a judgement, more of an aversion, kind if like a plague.  Kind of the way i view the young girls/women walking around clutching their cell phones for dear life.  It is a representation of what is wrong with the world today.
I guess i should blog this some day.peacemichael

michaelsits : in spite of myself
about 19 hours later
michaelsits said

Updated info.
It turns out abortion is both legal and popular in korea.  There are no single mothers here.

Nicole : wakingdreamer
1 day later
Nicole said

I see… hmm. So it isn't seen as a conflict with religion there?

If you do turn out to do a blog on cell phone reliance as metaphor for what is wrong with modern society, I'm keen to read it!

michaelsits : in spite of myself
1 day later
michaelsits said

i actually asked my source of information about the religious conflict and she being a Catholic herself, casually said, “No” without any flinch.  I asked her if that was true for Buddhists as well.  She said, “Yes” with equally no reaction.  tis coming from a very reactive and expressive young woman.  i left the conversation somewhat puzzled and wanting to know more.  i do not get how koreans can be so dilligent and grounded in so many aspects of life, well, except for life itself it would appear in tis case.  Unless the social lack of acceptance of single motherhood is so strong that women find a way to reconcile regardless.  i hope that i am wrong about the last statement but fear i may be correct.
The cell phone piece will come when i am ready to be less judgmental, tonight is not that night…

Nicole : wakingdreamer
1 day later
Nicole said

i believe it may have to do with the Asian cultures, where abortion is simply a fact of life, an unavoidable necessity at times rather than a moral conflict.

michaelsits : in spite of myself
2 days later
michaelsits said

Another update on how do you know?i was informed by an american esl teacher living in korea for many years that married women wear their hair down and single women wear it up or on pony tail or similarly.  I think this may have been more true in the past then the present though.  Women married and single wear it both ways regularly.

Nicole : wakingdreamer
4 days later
Nicole said

darn! :) that would have been a quick easy way eh?

michaelsits : in spite of myself
4 days later
michaelsits said

yes it would, although i do not think i qualify as someone who EVER takes the easy way, not my style.  I come form the bounce your head against the wall ten times till you get the point school of life.  Besides, i do not think that is what i came here for.
More shall revealed…

Nicole : wakingdreamer
4 days later
Nicole said

hmm, sounds a little like me, people accuse me of refusing to do things but the most difficult way LOL!

I never thought it was what you came there for either. It will be interesting to see. There has already been tremendous learning, from what i can see.

michaelsits : in spite of myself
4 days later
michaelsits said

as a side note, i was wanted to see which blogs on my role were “popular” and fro some reason, The Korean Haircut is now my most popular blog, passing the great conversations we has on Being Offended.  I am baffled on why this would be, in fact, i do not know why the ones that are listed and have been viewed the most are there, they are not the ones i would pick except for a couple.  My favorite pieces, De-Expression, Please Leave your shoes at the Door, The Man in the Lighthouse, The Road not Taken,Thunderstorms, Beth, The assignment: past lives, especially De-Expression nobody read. Apparently i should not become an editor because what i like does not seem to be of interest to others. Any thoughts? What is your experience on this sort of thing?

Nicole : wakingdreamer
4 days later
Nicole said

(By the way, I don't think it has anything to say on your being an editor.)

LOL! I find it amusing and bemusing what are the most popular blogs, here, have a look at my own list of most popular blogs:

History of Darfur conflict (4844
)Walking in the Air - … (4151)
“no one, not even the… (3526)
The 7 chakras (1902)
David Whyte poem (1549)
True Love - David Whyte (1401)
The Bait - John Donne (1351
)beautiful picture by … (1066)
The Little Prince - L… (1057)
somewhere i have neve… (988)

All the others are poems written by others,
a history of Darfur from Wikipedia (go figure!) 
plus a song people apparently love (Walking in the Air).

In terms of the “hot ” blogs, that generated most comments, it is similarly … interesting :)

Lesson? You never know what will generate the most hits or comments. Fortunately, it doesn't matter. Why should others like what I like or share my interests? But what they actually focus on and enjoy is intriguing.

No one read De-Expression? Now I must take a look.

Here is the list of my hottest blogs. There is a little bit of method to the madness, as I reflect. What had been the occasion of deepest pain and emotional reactivity to me became the subject of the blog with the most hits. Most of the others have a lot to do with emotional complications and involved explorations of my life and travels. But still, it is…

fascinating :) the disconnect at times.

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